Celebrity Apprentice (with Dionne)

[gillanddon]

Hello Bach to Bacharach! Gosh it's sometimes hurtful reading your stuff. Actually I didn't think Dionne was as bad on Celebrity Apprentice as you and others have made out! Everyone knows what that programme is about and yes I'm sure a lot of it is scripted .. I can almost hear the convesation between her and Donald Trump .. he persuading her to come on the show to give it a bit of a 'celebrity boost' and her finally agreeing to give her new CD a boost but only if she can stay in on a few sessions! I think she thought she might enjoy it but eventually started struggling with the other team mates so started looking irritated and who wouldn't? I also think that the music industry is notorious as one of the worst ever .. everyone back stabbing everyone else etc how can these women survive in it if they arn't tough? They all come over as really hard arsed if you think about it. On the autograph side, I've had an autograph signed by Dionne after her Cole Porter concert at the Albert Hall in London and she was absolutely charming and she saw everyone in the long que. I also think we have to make allowance for the consequences of fame and one of them, and it seems to happen to nearly all of them, is they become very nassicistic and self obsessed. To me it seems enevitable with all the attention and adoration etc I think it also leads to self destruction ie Michael Jackson, Elvis etc the list is long. Please be gentle on this extraordinary woman or I might start feeling sorry for her and she would hate that!

[BachtoBacharach]

I am as gentle with this extraordinary singer as she is with others. I'm just calling it as I see it and you are calling it as you see it.

[Dionnefan]

It's interesting to me how complementary Darlene Love was in her book towards Dionne. She did say that Dionne could get VERY testy when someone messed up while on stage, which in a way I can respect (seems like a dedication to putting on the best show possible), but otherwise, she did many many wonderful and generous things for her employees and friends. And honestly, I don't think it is that horrible that sometimes celebrities don't sign autographs. I mean can you imagine constantly being harassed like that? I wonder how Dionne has remained friends with people like Gladys for decades if she is so so horrible.

On a personal note, I met Dionne myself when her Dionne Sings Dionne album came out at a large mega-bookstore. She was very gracious and signed autographs for everyone. She was very impressed when I set in front of her about 15 CD booklets of her various albums and she signed every one of them. I even got her to sign a DeeDee CD booklet. Dionne stated "that's my baby" when she saw the DeeDee booklet.

I wonder how the Dionne of the 80's would have been had this show been around back then. I have a feeling some of Dionne's "crotchedyness" (is that a word?) comes from just being older, tired, and from having the constant pressure of oweing millions of dollars to the IRS on her back. I bet that could make ANYONE cranky. I personally did not see what was so so terrible about the way Dionne behaved on the show. Sure she wasn't exactly nice, but I really didn't see her do anything that was shocking or horrible. I agreed with her telling off the people that kept trying to butt in on the projects she was working on.

[gillanddon]

Thank you Dionnefan for broadening it out and also putting across the other side of things. As I've said before after 50 years in the industry it's amazing how incredibly well she has managed to stay recording and touring. I am relieved though that she is off Celebrity Apprentice as I was feeling fairly anxious about it being the wrong place for her. I love her new CD.

[MarkusFlavius]

I was a bit surprised that Dionne was the one to exit "Celebrity Apprentice" this week for leaving early when her job was done. I can see the teamwork aspect of all the ladies hanging around for the editing, but it looked like the end of a long day and Dionne had finished her part. She did throw the "matriarch" line in there, so I'm sure that didn't help her much with her peers in the end. In my opinion, LaToya or Hope were more deserving of exiting than Dionne...........and, of course, Dionne didn't offer up another person in her place when asked, so that was the kiss of death for The Donald (the same thing happened with Nikki Taylor earlier).

In the van, Dionne said she was going to go home, but told NeNe she would stay if she was needed. A good project manager would have given her either a strong yes or no response, and NeNe didn't do that or fess up to it in the board room. Rolling eyes don't count! It almost looked too scripted to me that "that bit" would result in Dionne being fired. I thought Dionne handled herself well in the conference room (which she has done each time), and I was glad she called NeNe a coward, but then kept her cool and still exited gracefully.

And, by the way, I thought Dionne looked great in the show ----- she may be the oldest, but she hardly looks her age. When she wore the sparkly beret in the last show, I thought that was a good look for her ----- way better than those baseball hats. (She must have a lot of bad hair days!) I keep going back to Dionne's low public profile and "classy" reputation, so her strong, opinionated manner in this show doesn't probably sit well with the folks who have been critical of her behavior. If it were Streisand or Diana Ross in the show, people would think they were just being their "bitchy selves." And.... I love Dionne's new album also.

[gillanddon]

Nice to hear that MarkusFlavius, you echo my sentiments entirely! Yes I agree, the baseball caps have to go!

[BachtoBacharach]

Just throwing this out there for consideration. I see that this describes many, many celebrities, not only Dionne.

Someone with Narcissistic Personality disorder (NPD) has at least 5 of these symptoms:

•has a grandiose sense of self-importance (e.g., exaggerates achievements and talents, expects to be recognized as superior without commensurate achievements)
•is preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
•believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by, or should associate with, other special or high-status people (or institutions)
•requires excessive admiration
•has a sense of entitlement, i.e., unreasonable expectations of especially favorable treatment or automatic compliance with his or her expectations
•is interpersonally exploitative, i.e., takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
•lacks empathy: is unwilling to recognize or identify with the feelings and needs of others
•is often envious of others or believes that others are envious of him or her
•shows arrogant, haughty behaviors or attitudes

[Dionnefan]

Well of course DIonne is a narcissist! What celebrity isn't? I think something Nikki Taylor said when describing Dionne really summed it up (and I'm paraphrasing): "It might be hard for Dionne to work with others, she essentially has been doing it her way as a one woman show for many, many, many years!" (almost 50! to be exact). Still, I don't think she's inherently an evil person or that she is so much worse than any other person who has been cheered and idolized for 50 years! It's easy for us to pass judgement. None of us has any idea what it's like to live this way. It's no wonder that Michael Jackson, who acheived a level of fame that far surpassed Dionne's, couldn't cope with life in a healthy way.

[BachtoBacharach]

Dionne has, for the most part, hidden her narcissism well from the public for all those years and I think that is why this is so shocking for many of her fans...her "fanatics" will be loyal to her no matter what and will excuse her behavior but those mainstream fans who have bought her recordings and supported her career and made her rich and famous all these years are abandoning her. They expect this sort of behavior from the likes of Franklin, Ross and Streisand because it's not a secret and never has been. I've spoken to many longtime fans in the past few days who feel betrayed and let down and who feel as though Dionne has sold them a bill of goods all these years with, from their perceptions, her now obviously phony public personna. I have always known that Dionne could be very, very difficult but she has been so smart about hiding it and so have her publicists. I really question why she choose to now, at 70 years of age, to "come out" of the closet so to speak and to 7 million people. It's much like Mel Gibson...shocking behavior from him because of his carefully crafted image...although Dionne being mean and hateful is in no way comparable to what Mel did, to many of her fans it's as shocking as Mel's apparent about face. But that's just it...it wasn't an about face, it was a con job in their perception, and many fans feel duped. She was so carefully "not nasty" in her book and then she just let's it all come out on Trump's freak show and it's hard to even crack the book now knowing it's a bit of marshmallow fluff that reveals NOTHING about the REAL Dionne. Don't understand at all why she did this and never will. I think many fans would have stuck with her had she been true to herself and her public and allowed the bitchiness to come out once in a while as with Franklin and Streisand...remember most her fans had no idea she really is this way because they've been spoonfed the elegant, classy, and sweet image. Dionne's art is her music and thank goodness she can't taint that but there are those who don't like her music any longer because they don't like her and for most of her mainstream fans, she and her music are inseparable.

[Dionnefan]

Well Bach, I am definitely one of the "fanatics"!!!! Dionne could do just about anything short of killing puppy dogs and babies and I will still love her. I mean honestly, I don't have to live with her, so why should I let the fact that she might be a "bitch" interfere with my enjoyment of her music. I also think alot of this comes back to the double standard that is applied to women. If a man had behaved the way Dionne did, he would be proclaimed as "strong-willed", not labeled as a nasty bitch. Dionne is a diva with a capital "D" and I like it!

I find it utterly ridiculous that people would not buy her music because she was somewhat rude on a reality show where such behavior is encouraged! I guess people should not buy Burt's recordings either because he has behaved like a real jerk before. And Bach, none of this is aimed at you--I understand what you're saying.

[gillanddon]

Yes, I feel the same Dionnefan .. I think a lot of people encourage and like the diva type behavior in their 'stars' and it promotes interest rather than detracts from it. Also,it's interesting with Elizabeth Taylor's recent passing how for many years she came across as one really formidable and intimidating lady and yet nearly all of the zillions of obituraries say how sweet and kind she was. It is interesting what you say about male celebs being able to get away with it rather than women which I think is very true and has always been the case with the media being male led. I also think Dionne, like Liz Taylor, behave differently toward men than toward women. I think she would have been more relaxed, softer and a bit more fun on Celebrity Apprentice if the teams were mixed.